AI systems integration

[Scarrow]

I have noticed that the AI systems that you have been working on are integrated into the actual server. This may make it a little difficult to develop custom AI systems to work with each individual developers needs. Currently I am looking at using RAIN AI for my project. Is their going to be any chance of being able to integrate a custom AI system into the plugin system or the server itself without conflicting with the original server AI system ?

[Swampdog]

I think if you run something outside of what they are developing, you'll probably want to develop a plug-in for it where you can control it server-side (authoritative). Otherwise you open yourself up to cheaters being able to manipulate the AI a lot easier. I'm curious what everyone is using for AI myself. How many are planning on just using stock AI, RAIN, or other AI systems and how you are integrating.

[Scarrow]

Yeah I was going to build a plugin so to basically run the RAIN ai trees and execute the actions for the NPC's through it. It would have to include several parts IE first You would have to build a custom database for it which you can access through python and then create the AI in RAIN unity side and then export the files into the Database to be accessed by the plugin later. Dont know yet still have to think about it some more I will eventually get it.

[Scarrow]

Actually thinking about it now anyone know if they are gonna offer the plugins in Java as well since they are thread safe compared to python?

[jbarrett98121]

i have been using shooter ai, it works well. but nothing that would work networked. sure would be a nice update

[sooms]

Not too sure how well we will be able to integrate other AI systems into the server yet, I haven't had the time to look into it. Depending on how the system has been developed in Unity it may be possible to write a server side that just sends the data needed to the system on the client. At the end of Alpha we can start looking at the more popular AI systems around and plan how we may be able to allow integration with them.

[jbarrett98121]

ai is just an extremely hard part of a game to program right, and there's tons of ai packages out there that are already awesome. It would almost make more sense to implement one of them.

[jbarrett98121]

rain one is free for everyone and amazing............

[Swampdog]

The problem with using what is out there, out of the box so to speak, is that they run client-side. They will probably all work fine but the problem is when they are run on the client, they could be more easily hacked. While it may not be impossible to hack an authoritative server, it is a lot harder if the server is controlling the AI, physics, collision, etc. That is why it would be awesome to be able to at least set up a plugin to control the asset, similar to what the GM folks have been working on for UniStorm. Would be great to have something similar for RAIN or some of the other more popular AI systems.

[jbarrett98121]

one question i have about a completely server based ai system is on performance............ how is something like that going to perform, when 1000+ users are all connected, and all being sent data from the server about where and what the ai is doing?

 

i knopw it's just location data, but say a server has 200 mobs spawned out, and a ton of people connected. The server has to send the data out for all 200 mobs to every single client connected.

 

 

just wonder how smoothly that kind of thing will be able to be handled.

[neojac]

no server just needs to send out data of mobs and players that is close to that specific player so not all 200 unless you have 200 mobs and 1000 players all in the same place

[Scarrow]

I was thinking of more along the lines of build the needed AI system Using Rain inside of unity and then when all done and said export the needed AI files to the server to perform needed functions and such. You can DESIGN it in RAIN on the unity client side and then just export the AI files to the server for actual execution. Keep the tables/values stored in a database file of course and then just access once server starts up. AI writes would require a server restart but shrug its better then trying to design a whole new system from scratch.

[aquilina]

i was thinking about this my self, but was going to create my own Dynamic AI system based off events but was not sure how to get it working in game. could be done easily i think, but my only issue is getting it on the server. perhaps someone with server knowledge is willing to help out here, and others with plugin knowledge,

 

perhaps something we can do as a community to share and help speed up some of this production.

 

just some thoughts if anyone is interested, i got some ideas on how to make a Dynamic Ai system based on RPG elements. but can defiantly do with a lot more work.

[droptopgames]

Okay here is my input on the subject. The server side AI is simple enough if all parties can agree but even when we had the discussion here we couldn't actually agree on the best way to tackle it. We get half way there and then start finding holes.

 

What specific AI scripts are we looking at; I note RAIN AI has been mentioned, but what specifically about RAIN makes it more impressive than say Advanced Fantasy AI Pack? I was looking to use a cross section but its a LOT of work to code so many different AI into the system which is why we originally looked at LUA script implementation so people could use a more comfortable language to code new AI.

 

But i am heavily interested in adding AI into our ChaosPlugin, we already have weather, scheduling, music systems, I'm working on transports at the moment. Now would be the time to speak up

[kobaltic]

I think rain AI was chosen as it is free. Which also means it will probably have a bigger customer base to help support it. As for AI. I think most stuff is already there. The biggest thing I would like to see (and it may already be in there) is AI against AI.

 

Example: Our hero player arggos an enemy AI and runs back to the castle. When he arrives the AI gate guards come running out and defeats the enemy to protect the castle and of coarse our player.

[droptopgames]

okay when we talk about AI, I think I need to clarify. Artificial Intelligence does not require the player to trigger an event to cause the combat. AI should be intelligent enough to make choices, attack a target based on its comparative level, do other things other than stand there waiting for something to happen.

 

Responsive combat IS NOT Artificial Intelligence. Most of whats in place is a random chance combat. There is already a known way to bork the CombatAI in Atavism. I'm talking about extending that so that we get battlefield style combat, players being stalked by mobs for long distances; Being able to do other tasks like smithing when not being talked to; having commands at certain times of the day etc. NOT included with atavism currently.