Atavism for Unreal Engine

[Martin (Dragonsan)]

Thank you for your feedback. If we will invest in this project, it will certainly take a while, but we are close to making this step.

[retired]

You can't go wrong here. Unreal is a better engine and desperately needs a complete framework. MMO KIT(the only option with a database) is extremely barebones. The only MMO KIT for Unreal is https://forums.unrealengine.com/development-discussion/content-creation/23921-mmo-starter-kit he has 135 pages of threads so you can imagine the interest in UE4 mmo frameworks. I know some folks here aren't going to like it, but not really fair to the dev team to hold back becasue of them. It's not like you're killing unity support.

[Recon]

hI I post as Recon  in the channel a lot.  I been a game developer since the 1990's I can tell you from experience,  That many users would want it for Unreal, I work with many companies, investors, who refuse to use Unity anymore, due to its poor support and many assets that are not supported properly or tested in real games.

 

Now I'm a Unity user   and will always continue to do so. as I like the engine, but I do find myself using Unreal more, I have for over 15 years, Unity about 10 or so. I find Unreal to NOT need any assets or as many... this is a good thing as many things are built into the engine....You also get the source, Unity we don't... 

If you make a game with Unreal  its 5% and lower....many pay about 1-2 % if they are lucky..   I won't say how I know, but you can ask for your self:)  They do custom licenses... and most of the time much less.  I been using Unreal as I said 15 years and I own ZERO assets and make some of my own.

.. The reason is most of what is needed is built in.. and properly tested by AAA games and other companies... This is a huge bonus. right now we have two games being made, Unity one and Unreal, both are open world....

In Unity Right now we spent about 2 grand more in tools made, hired people to make tools, we spent way more time making tools needed..   and we started about the same time, the Unreal game is nearly a year ahead.

 

So these are my experiences and examples of  why I like Unreal.. Now why you guys should  support Unreal.  Unreal users, typically don't mind paying for quality at all...No offense, some Unity users do..  Clearly ones here do not. but World Creator is about 300 dollars and they even found more customers are willing to pay for quality assets, where SOME Unity users won't so I see way more Unreal users over there than Unity .

.  So this can only benefit you guys.  This can also benefit Unity users by having experience Unreal users on Discord helping other members....so it will make a community that much better and bigger at the end of the day.. as  everyone can reach there end goal which is to make a good game. 

I'm also in business, so I think this could help you in that area, which could help fund, Unity even more so, and Avatism as a whole...  

 

PS: This was not to bash Unity. I like Unity due to its Editor and I met some great people over the years.. but professional I use Unreal way more. due to reasons I stated.   Unity struggles with  Open World games, and anyone who made a large game before knows, Unity can be annoying to work with and many assets as well. 

So having something good like Atavism, would benefit both engines. at the end of the day and the company as a whole as I was saying. so I hope you consider it . This would make me want to invest as it would show me how serious you guys are, with helping actually game developers......because many assets I feel ignore actually game developers, and only worry about making a fast buck.... Which is a turn off to many investors, companies and people who do make games for a living. 

Thanks for reading.

 

Recon.

[Martin (Dragonsan)]

Thank you for this very comprehensive feedback Recon.

We wouldn't ask you about Atavism for Unreal version and waste your time guys if we wouldn't think about this project seriously. Right now the question is not if, but when

[retired]

I have a long history with both engines, similar Recon. He's spot on with his analysis. Coming back to Unity after a couple years I can see they are trying to catch up to Unreal. The whole LWRP an HWRP thing is a bit of a mess, Unreal is a complete package out of the box. Both are great engines, I don't mind using Unity when it's required for the job, but Unreal is my go to as they just have much more to offer. If it isn't source code, it's dev grants, if it isn't that it's free games, free assets monthly, royalty deals, such a generous company. Unity won't even let you use some assets in their free demos and charge money for their other demos.

Edited September 2, 2019 by retired

[GSG Games]

Would love to see this for Unreal, I am currently subscribed for the Unity version, I am a beginner and do not have much experience, this is a hobby for me, I decided on Unity just for this engine. I would however like an Unreal conversion.

[Recon]

13 hours ago, Killersan said:

Thank you for this very comprehensive feedback Recon.

We wouldn't ask you about Atavism for Unreal version and waste your time guys if we wouldn't think about this project seriously. Right now the question is not if, but when

Np.  Ya I can understand that. I say that, because so many do, with Unity assets, and this can be annoying, and a huge waste of time.   I know your serious. due to the time you put in. but some people have surprised me and went a different way.  Which has caused problems for me and people I worked with before. so I'm always skeptical, when it comes to anything.. until I see it in action. 

 

I wish you speedy and successful release for Unreal. !

[Recon]

On 6/19/2019 at 1:09 PM, Aizen said:

Unreal dont got that many assets and i wold say no coos i dont wanna se team get split and then takes longer  to get updates + i dont wanna pay 5% to Unreal

 

Unreal don't need that many assets or any, after 15 years of using it, I own ZERO a big fat goose egg and I use way more than Unity.. Unity I own prolly about 200..and maybe 5 are good to decent....  Unreal has most of it built in, and we have source to make our own stuff, fast...with out needing to wait for an update like we do with Unity.

 

Also, 5% most pay less..and if you release on there store...Steam you pay 30%.....  if you release on Unreal store and use the engine, you pay a total of about 13% total....this includes that  %5.... Where  if you release a game on Steam with Unity its 30% and way more.....  as a developer we are releasing on Unreal store first , this includes our Unity game plus our Unreal games...so keep this in mind.... I have used both engines professional extensively and anyone else who has, will tell you, you spend much less time in Unreal, and less money... due to not needing to hire people, or buy assets.....  and less headaches.... I use both today extenstively and I curse way more when building larger worlds in Unity and always making a new tool due to the engine lacking it....or needing to buy it...Unreal I made a hand full and own zero..Unity I made about 16 tool and own 200 or so...and right now needing to make two new tools.... as much as I still like Unity.... Unreal is still much better in nearly every regard.  but I still have love for Unity ..... So this would only help any developer.

 

I talk to some people to try Unreal and actually use it for a few months most never come back to Unity.   So this can only help Avatism. at the end of the day... as Unreal could really use something like it, most assets I would say no..it don't need it...  This one, I would say yes. Yes they have some built in tools....but not all for an MMORPG. so this would sell well... and people would not throw a fit about cost...

[BJPickles]

To follow this up, the lack of support for unreal has been the reason we haven't bought Atavism.

As mentioned earlier, it's simply the scale factor, and the tried and tested (AAA) resources we have at our disposal in UE4 that makes it the go-to engine. It's certainly not perfect, but it's ahead of the curve. It feels like a AAA quality product.

Unity, on the other hand, feels rather more ... Indie. That's not to diss Unity, but it's apparent they're playing catch-up.

Sea of Thieves is a perfect example of simplicity in UE4, with the ability to build upon it. In terms of the effort in the physics - it's huge, but that's UE4 handling that internally, and that's about it! Plain GUIs for text etc. Animation heavy (again UE4).

It's a wonderful opportunity to bring Atavism X - with the full scalability - into an engine that can handle that scaling.

 

The only advice I have to give regarding Atavism as it stands - is that things like character animation that aren't finished (or in a basic form) look unprofessional, and diminish the overall quality of the product.

Watching the videos, I could see that it is mostly to do with Unity, but it didn't look smooth, thus the reason we haven't bought Atavism. Having to fix jagged and janky character animations / walking is just another job and Unity isn't very kind in this regard.

Obviously there's no physics, so that would have be added into the client but we all know that's far more achievable with UE4.

Easily fixable in UE4, but a headache in Unity.

 

Very much looking forward to this!

Especially premium accounts, and high ranking players!!

[Martin (Dragonsan)]

2 hours ago, BJPickles said:

To follow this up, the lack of support for unreal has been the reason we haven't bought Atavism.

As mentioned earlier, it's simply the scale factor, and the tried and tested (AAA) resources we have at our disposal in UE4 that makes it the go-to engine. It's certainly not perfect, but it's ahead of the curve. It feels like a AAA quality product.

Unity, on the other hand, feels rather more ... Indie. That's not to diss Unity, but it's apparent they're playing catch-up.

Sea of Thieves is a perfect example of simplicity in UE4, with the ability to build upon it. In terms of the effort in the physics - it's huge, but that's UE4 handling that internally, and that's about it! Plain GUIs for text etc. Animation heavy (again UE4).

It's a wonderful opportunity to bring Atavism X - with the full scalability - into an engine that can handle that scaling.

 

The only advice I have to give regarding Atavism as it stands - is that things like character animation that aren't finished (or in a basic form) look unprofessional, and diminish the overall quality of the product.

Watching the videos, I could see that it is mostly to do with Unity, but it didn't look smooth, thus the reason we haven't bought Atavism. Having to fix jagged and janky character animations / walking is just another job and Unity isn't very kind in this regard.

Obviously there's no physics, so that would have be added into the client but we all know that's far more achievable with UE4.

Easily fixable in UE4, but a headache in Unity.

 

Very much looking forward to this!

Especially premium accounts, and high ranking players!!

Thank you for your feedback.

Yes, we want to prepare more complete animation controller, but we don't have our own animations, so we cannot redistribute them. But you can see them in action in the demo, which as any element can be improved. Anyway, we are working on that part, to forge new cooperations, fill that gap, and make Atavism even more complete.

Server-side physics is on our list for 2020, but we will see what will be on the roadmap presented in February 2020.

We already started working on the next release, which is planned for November, so stay tuned

[BJPickles]

9 minutes ago, Killersan said:

Thank you for your feedback.

Yes, we want to prepare more complete animation controller, but we don't have our own animations, so we cannot redistribute them. But you can see them in action in the demo, which as any element can be improved. Anyway, we are working on that part, to forge new cooperations, fill that gap, and make Atavism even more complete.

Server-side physics is on our list for 2020, but we will see what will be on the roadmap presented in February 2020.

We already started working on the next release, which is planned for November, so stay tuned

Very excited, keep up th good work!

[Martin (Dragonsan)]

We are pleased to inform you that we will make Atavism for Unreal. Very roughly it should take around 9 months. We will keep you updated about the progress. We also want to prepare a separate forum section to split Unity/Unreal versions and discord server to handle discussion related to Atavism for Unreal and not disturb our Unity Community.

[Teager]

I've just rediscovered atavism today after looking at it and discarding it years ago due to apparent inactivity from the devs. I must say, I'm thrilled to see that it's in active development again, and better still that it's coming to unreal!

I've been tracking progress of mmo and single player rpg solutions for unreal, and haven't been completely satisfied with any that I've found. Some have solid networking solutions but not much of a game package to build on or instructional help for less experienced devs. Others have more extensive sample packages and tutorial content, but lack major multiplayer features (or multiplayer at all). Atavism comes the closest, out of what I've seen, to providing a complete mmo solution for small team indy devs.

I'm very encouraged by what you guys have achieved in the last year in terms of frequency of updates, new features, and tutorial content. If you can achieve the same feature list and a similar quality of documentation on the Unreal platform, you can consider me sold 🤩

Can't wait to see what you create!

[Martin (Dragonsan)]

9 hours ago, Teager said:

I've just rediscovered atavism today after looking at it and discarding it years ago due to apparent inactivity from the devs. I must say, I'm thrilled to see that it's in active development again, and better still that it's coming to unreal!

I've been tracking progress of mmo and single player rpg solutions for unreal, and haven't been completely satisfied with any that I've found. Some have solid networking solutions but not much of a game package to build on or instructional help for less experienced devs. Others have more extensive sample packages and tutorial content, but lack major multiplayer features (or multiplayer at all). Atavism comes the closest, out of what I've seen, to providing a complete mmo solution for small team indy devs.

I'm very encouraged by what you guys have achieved in the last year in terms of frequency of updates, new features, and tutorial content. If you can achieve the same feature list and a similar quality of documentation on the Unreal platform, you can consider me sold 🤩

Can't wait to see what you create!

I'm glad that you like how we improved Atavism.

We are also very excited about this new Atavism for the Unreal project.

[HeadClot]

Hey @Killersan I am a member from the old forums when neojack was in charge of Atavism. Got a question for you. What is the planned pricing for Atavism for Unreal? I will have a good chunk of change in my pocket come payday.

[Martin (Dragonsan)]

Hello @HeadClot. We have no business model ready yet. We are focusing on making the product ready, and the business model will be introduced along the road.

[HeadClot]

3 hours ago, Killersan said:

Hello @HeadClot. We have no business model ready yet. We are focusing on making the product ready, and the business model will be introduced along the road.

Got it. Thank you for the info